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The Aussies don't want to be outdone?

 
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The Aussies don't want to be outdone by Greece..
They are negative to allow their Olympics to be remembered more;
84%
 84%  [ 16 ]
They are totally unbiased, and just happen to be the country with the most problems concernig Athena 2004;
15%
 15%  [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 19

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Reaper the pure
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 7:53 pm    Post subject: The Aussies don't want to be outdone? Reply with quote

What is more likely?
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Australian media has been horrible towards us.... deserved or undeserved.
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It looks like we are defending Greece all over the net Chris!! Shocked !!
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A poll can be skewed or shaped to provide the desired results through the wording of its questions. Some Aussies may be a tad arrogant in their view of Greek organisational capabilities but the poll questions are leading and biased.

What was wrong with a simple question like, "Do you feel that comments by the Australian media and Australian people with regard to the 2004 Olympics have been unduly negative"? Or, even better, a question that would give respondents a chance to indicate the degree to which they think Aussie comments about the Athens Olympics have been unfair and unnecessarily negative?

And yes, I AM an Aussie! But one who's been to Greece many times and who is planning to have a great time at the 2004 Olympics. Smile

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the wording is fine. People either think that the Aussies have been vicious and unfair or not. If it is somewhere inbetween, that shows in itself that at some stage they have been bias, which therefore fits neatly into cat 1. All i know is anyone who votes in the second cat has to look deep within themselves for doing so, or actually believe it! or just don't care. If Greece's media slated Austrailia 4 getting the 2000 games, (which really should have gone back to its birth place on that special number in some peoples minds), i would say, 'yes, my media attacked u only 4 that reason', not anything else/./ Rolling Eyes Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anonymous wrote:
It looks like we are defending Greece all over the net Chris!! Shocked !!


Laughing Cool


@ CheeseburgerParadise, my words are more or less pointed towards the Australian Media. Every single article I read coming from there, is always negative. They are VERY much anti-Athens 2004. I don't know about the Australian people in general, but most Greeks I know from Aussie land say they are the same way. (not much choice when you see what they are being fed).
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2004 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just out of curiosity, I'd be mighty grateful if, whenever anybody finds a hostile article about the forthcoming Olympics in the Australian media, they could post a link to it in here so that we could all see exactly what we're up against here.

Personally, I've seen what's known as 'poo-pooing' of the organisational skills and bragging about how great the 2000 Games were but nothing that really criticises the city of Athens or the venues themselves. It's the getting them ready in time that most people write about in the Aussie media (as in the Greek and other media for that matter) and let's face it; we're all a little bit apprehensive about how everything will eventually look and work given the tight timeframe the organising committee's backed itself into.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Aussies probably just don't want to be outdone by anyone. I am a Greek American living in Washington D.C. and I have herd some ridiculous things come from the Washington Post(Local Newspaper) and other news organizations such as the Greeks will not be redy on time and that the Olympics will be moved to Atlanta for 2004!! No one seems to want to give Greece a chance. It does not matter how the Athens 2004 Olympics will be people will search for something negative to write about the Greeks.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unless we prove them all wrong!! Cool
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems to me that alot of people are being hyper-sensitive when it comes to criticism leveled at Greece or at the the preparations for the 2004 Olympics.
Sure, the Aussies (having pulled off a spectacularly successful and fun Olympiad themselves, we have to admit) will be haughty, condescending, patronising, overbearing, presumptuous...........whatever!...... in some of their reporting of the preparations. But that doesn't translate to hostility. And it certainly does not mean that they want to see the Olympic games fail. After all, Australian athletes will also be there and every Aussie wants them to do as well as possible.

It's only natural that people will compare Athens 2004 to the Games that preceeded them and that people will be on the lookout for what - in their minds at least - Sydney did better, nicer, more successfully. This doesn't mean that Athenians or Greek supporters of the Games should develop an inferiority complex or take any criticism in a petulant and aggressively defensive manner. As Christos 7 said, "Let's prove them all wrong"!!

Unfortunately, for all the hope, confidence, and goodwill we in this forum have about the forthcoming Games, there are many more people out there who have thus far exhibited apathy and disinterest on the one hand (look at the slow ticket sales and constant grumbling about construction in and around Athens) and outright incompetence on the other (I've already written about some of the ills that plague the Game's organisation in another post!) We all have to admit that for all the years of preparation, the look, feel and 'success' of the Games will all be determined by what's done within the next 6 months. The basic infrastructure WILL be ready I believe, but it's also shameful that SO much remains to be completed in so short a timeframe.

I guess this knowledge makes all who care about the success of the Games, or feel Athenian/Greek pride at being able to host them, just a little nervous and reflexively defensive every time something critical is said or written about Athen's ability to host the Games. I mean, the IOC gave Athens/Greece a chance to shine on the world stage and so far we've seen hardly a glimmer. Alot of people have that gnawing feeling that perhaps the organisers have shot themselves in the foot and that's simply not something that people wish to hear repeatedly. Criticism that has a grain of truth to it is always hardest to take.

But rest assured that come Game time, all but the most cynical and hard-hearted Australian, American, etc., will want everything to run smoothly so that they can concentrate on the sports and cheer their preferred athletes on to victory.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When your massive olympic torch failed on the opening night infront of the world, my Greek mother went 'aaaaahhh noo' and genuinely felt sorry 4 u. I just wonder if the Australians would be as sympathetic if something as dramatic as that happens on the opening night in Athena? Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrow cheeseburger paradise

I don’t really see any hostility from the Australian media, however, I do see a childish attempt to convince the world that the 2000 Games were, and will remain, second to none! OK, we got the point, you have been reminding that to the whole world over and over and over, for four years now! So what? Won't that ever stop? Is Athens allowed to take over now, since it's our turn, please? Laughing

Furthermore, this whole paranoid thing is emphasized by all those outrageous comparisons (!!) with the Athens Games, but there is another point here: The 2004 Games have not even started yet, for Christ's sake, we still have 6 months to go, my friend!! Shocked I’m sorry, but common sense indicates that no comparisons can be held between two dissimilar things. Aussies can compare themselves with Barcelona or Atlanta if they wish so, not with Athens (yet); it’s unfair...

On the other hand, something changed in the world on 9/11, and Athens has been unlucky enough to be asked to organize the first Games of a “different”, insecure, frustrated era. Does anyone honestly believe that if Sidney was to organize the 2004 Olympics, things wouldn’t be totally different for Aussies? Because if I remember well, Australia is a top “legal target”, according to the terrorists’ credo, by having provided all support to the American troops in Afghanistan, and also to the Gulf Wars I & II.

So, let’s focus to the Games and their meaning now, which is expected to revive in Greece, and let’s stop jumping into generalizations and unfair conclusions. Everything is fully explainable regarding delays (too bad you cannot read the Greek forum), and I cannot apologize the whole time about obvious things, having to explain that I have no inferiority complex (!!), or having to defend my right to be different and react differently, under different circumstances, in a different environment!!!

And something else: Greek Media are absolutely friendly and supportive to the Beijing efforts in organizing their Games! Aussies should learn something from that, cause I think this shows -and explains- a lot... And no, we don’t do it just because they’re doing pretty well so far (which is true). Neither this means that we have nothing to criticize them, about.
On the contrary, there are a lot to be said about them, and the ways they use to achieve their goal!! But we still care about the Games and only, not about a ridiculous, useless, massive national ego-boost... Wink


Last edited by Ypsilon on Fri Feb 27, 2004 3:09 am; edited 3 times in total
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes but Ypsilon, don't forget that the same Greek media for our games have a "little" bad opinion while with the Chinese the best! Isn't this suspicious?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PAVEL_13 wrote:
Yes but Ypsilon, don't forget that the same Greek media for our games have a "little" bad opinion while with the Chinese the best! Isn't this suspicious?


This is irrelevant, Pavel, we live in this country and we know well it’s politics that gets involved in many ways, not to mention the forthcoming elections in 10 days.
I don’t question the evident right of the Aussies or anyone else to criticize, as long as it’s a “bona fide” and factual approach of the whole issue, and it’s not so bluntly rude against a whole nation’s feelings and common struggle.
And I presume you don't expect me to remind you what some foreign media have written against Greece, regarding the Games, during the past years. We respond with our progress, fine. Let’s not make it such a big deal, let’s just keep this record for history!
Wink


Last edited by Ypsilon on Thu Feb 26, 2004 9:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I second your opinion Ypsilon. If I may add something: it is a pity that none of the technological and organizational achievements linked with the 2004 Olympics are presented abroad. I don't know whose fault this is, and I'm not here to judge it, but I can bet that there is some prejudice against Athens which does not allow for the positive aspects to be presented to the greater public. There's really some good stuff going on here.

Ypsilon wrote:

And something else: Greek Media are absolutely friendly and supportive of the Beijing efforts in organizing their Games!


I fully agree and would like to add that it is not only the media that are supportive of Beijing 2008. An extensive cooperation and transfer of know-how has already started between the respective Olympic committees.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 2:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I may, I would like to add my opinion to this subject.
There is one thing that everyone outside of Greece has to remember....the games are finally coming to their birthplace....I hope to god that the organizing committee in Athens makes these Olympics not only a spectacular sports event but at the same time an educational tool to show the world what the Olympics are about and how they got started because no other country has ever spend the time or effort to do that in the past.
It does not matter what the US or Australian press says about whether or not we are going to be ready...Some things that people need to realize including Greeks that live abroad is that Greece is a country with only 10 mil. people and Greece does not have the resources that other big countries have like the US, Australia, England...etc. However, Greece possesses one thing that no other country that has hosted the Olympics so far has ever had ....THE HISTORY OF THE OLYMPIC GAMES.....this is more powerful than Visa, Coca Cola, cankerous, and all the other b@#$ s^%@ that has been the focal point of other Olympics in the past. In my opinion, none of the previous Olympics will ever hold a candle in front of the ones in 2004.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Athens may not be ready for Games: reports
7:36 AM March 4

The construction of facilities for the Athens Olympics is way behind schedule despite a recent positive assessment from visiting International Olympic Committee president Jacques Rogge, according to Greek media reports.

Olympic Games organisers hope that Athens will resemble a modern host city by the start of the Games in August, but the Greek media believes organisers may miss their target.

The respected right-wing daily Kathimerini newspaper says construction delays are now so great that the marathon route and a spectacular dome of the main Olympic stadium are unlikely to be ready in time.

The paper made the revelation just days after visiting Dr Rogge said he was confident Athens could stage an excellent Games if Greece kept up the hard work of preparing for them.

Source: ABC

www.abc.net.au
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,8872335%255E2703,00.html
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 6:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I realize this does not belong in this room but I am responding to the article from above....

The marathon route was almost completed by a company that went bankrupt…that is the only reason the project has not been finished. However, what remains to be finished has been picked up by another company and everything will be done in time for the Olympics in August

As far as the roof of the Olympic stadium, it will be a close call. A big mistake that a lot of people are making is that they are judging the completion of the roof by what has been done so far….that is a big misconception because the hard part of the job (The assembly of the skeleton) is done….the metal roof that will rest on the skeleton has already been assembled and all that remains is to put each peace into position….People are to anxious to see progress. The truth of the matter is that they are taking their time to insure that it is done right….
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

all we get from australians is shit!!! pardon my saying so, but its true.... i've seen this in other forums alot! paranoia, insecurity??? i dunno what it is but its really RUDE and cheap and immature! we would never do it to you man! Sad
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:59 pm    Post subject: Class Act by the Greeks Reply with quote

Class act by the Greek Olympic Organizing committee:

... The aim of this decision by the Organising Committee is to honour the previous city to have organised the Olympic Games, a city, moreover, which has thousands of Greek residents.

http://www.athens2004.com/athens2004/page/newslist?oid=dd6931e9b5f6bf00VgnVCMServer28130b0aRCRD&lang=en&cid=f1fc470429149f00VgnVCMServer28130b0aRCRD
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Up the Greek without a paddle

By Dave Hughes



MY BIG fat Greek mess.

With 142 days to go to the Friday 13 opening of the Olympic Games in Athens in August, the main stadium remains roofless, seatless and trackless.

The swimming pool is without water and shade. The tennis stadium is without a main court. The marathon route is, in places, without bitumen.

The surrounds of most venues resemble construction sites. There is no paving, no landscaping, no trees, no flowers, no marble monuments.

Work continues late into the night on associated projects such as tram tracks, train stations and power sub-stations.

No wonder the International Olympic Committee has dropped its diplomatic assurances and bluntly ordered Athens organisers to treat the preparations as less of a marathon and more of a sprint.

This was supposed to be the homecoming of the Olympics. Only, there is still no home to go to.

The main stadium in the northern suburb of Maroussi is a bare concrete bowl, without grass infield or track. Temporary lights burn past midnight as the first race of the 2004 Games continues at breakneck pace, the race to finish the project on time.

On either side of the stadium loom scaffold towers, which support the huge tubes nearly as high as the Sydney Harbour Bridge, from which a polycarbon roof will be suspended. Proclaimed as the showpiece construction for the Games, the sweeping canopy was supposed to be finished next month but doubts remain whether it will be complete by the end of July.

IOC chief Jacques Rogge says it is not strictly necessary but without it there is nothing on which to hang the floodlights necessary for the opening and closing ceremonies. And, while the two completed roof panels are inched into position over the stands, work cannot proceed in the arena.

Next door stands the aquatic complex. The competition pool contains nothing but a layer of cement dust. Individual plastic seats still have to be bolted to the grandstands. The pre-race assembly area has yet to be built.

Already, the promised roof has been abandoned. Organisers now doubt there is time to erect a temporary shelter, meaning spectators will swelter in the predicted 40C August sun.

More significantly, those who provide the biggest slice of funding for the Olympics, the television networks, are seething their cameras will have to deal with the glare of sun off water.

The narrow route north to the town of Marathon, along which the distance runners will stride, has sections which are paved inadequately.

A company was contracted to widen 16km of road but it ran out of money and did not pay its workers, who went on strike and quit.

Only 15 sports facilities are finished. Another 23 are not, although most are at least 90 per cent done. Only four - the main stadium, the swimming centre, the velodrome and the soccer stadium - are causing concern to the IOC.

Then there are delays with the mass transit projects, necessary to shift an expected one million visitors around a city already one of Europe's most congested.

The 32km train line linking Athens to the new airport is not finished. Nor is the station at Irini, designed to serve the main Olympic complex and the athletes' and media villages. The tram line to the coast is but a trench.

Complicating the situation is the turnover in senior staff. Costas Kartalis, No.3 on the organising committee and responsible for trains and trams, resigned two weeks ago.

So, what caused this big fat Greek mess? Simply, over-ambition and vanity.

Icarus-like, the organising committee tried to fly too high. In 1997, Athens staged a successful athletics world championships and showed the world's sports media an adequate although unspectacular aquatic centre and velodrome.

Minimal upgrading work would have been sufficient but the city administrators and politicians opted to go for a grand-slam spectacular.

The $250 million roof over the main stadium is an example. Designed by renowned Spanish architect Santiago Calatrava to be the modern landmark of ancient Athens, it symbolises the impractical extravagance which has hindered preparations.

Bureaucracy, labour disputes and political wrangling resulted in much of the lead-in time being squandered. Instead of outdoing Sydney, Athens is now emulating Montreal in 1976, when the Canadians ran out of time to put a roof on their stadium, and blew their budget.

Yet they managed to open their Games on time, just as the Athenians will. The IOC will ensure the core construction is complete and a decent Games goes ahead.

After all, if anyone can throw a good party, not to mention a discus, it is the Greeks.

(West Australian today) AUSTRALIAN PRESS OFCOURSE!!!

WELL YOU KNOW WHAT.... FUCK YOU!
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's all very well to be indignant at the criticism and occasional glee shown by the media when reporting the trials and tribulations of bringing the Olympics to Athens, but the situation IS worrying.

Not because of fear that the Olympics will not go ahead. But because of fear that the facilities will not all be more than 'adequate'; that athlete and spectator transportation systems will cause chaos; that the atmosphere will be somewhat less than festive.

It's not pleasant to see the tone with which articles such as the one posted by scatman are written. But could someone who is currently in Greece point out exactly what are the factual inaccuracies in this article?

Unfortunately, I suspect that any inaccuracies are minor....and that's something that has just as many Greeks pissed off as it may amuse some Australians, Americans or whatnot.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CheeseburgerParadise wrote:
But could someone who is currently in Greece point out exactly what are the factual inaccuracies in this article?

Unfortunately, I suspect that any inaccuracies are minor....


OK my friend, I’m afraid you give by yourself the answer you want. Wink

So, why should anyone bother to prove that those... inaccuracies are nothing but mere lies? If I come to Sydney on a day of a general strike and see tons of rubbish everywhere, and then report to the whole world that Sydney is the dirtiest city on the face of the earth, will you mind? Of course not! Because you live there and you know the truth, and you also know what caused that mess.
So, why should I apologize and explain everything to people who just don’t want to hear me, and they prove it day in - day out?

Personally I would never fall into that trap. Things in Athens are better than ever, reportings are here, hundreds of photos are here, just browse the Greek forum a little bit, and you will see with your very own eyes that the journalist from Australia just felt like being a «little more» aggressive and rude (who knows why? Wink ), and so he did!!! That’s all…
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